Comments on: Do not ask a theist to explain God's actions... http://conversationalatheist.com/2009/06/do-not-ask-a-theist-to-explain-gods-actions/ Atheists need to make more of an effort to be heard in their daily life. Wed, 07 Mar 2012 07:24:40 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v= By: Why Worship Someone With Mysterious Motives? – Camels With Hammers http://conversationalatheist.com/2009/06/do-not-ask-a-theist-to-explain-gods-actions/comment-page-1/#comment-3779 Why Worship Someone With Mysterious Motives? – Camels With Hammers Mon, 28 Jun 2010 22:16:06 +0000 http://conversationalatheist.com/?p=1041#comment-3779 [...] Conversational Atheist raises a good point: When you ask a person to explain God’s apparently contradictory actions, you [...]
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]]> By: The Evil God Hypothesis « Camels With Hammers http://conversationalatheist.com/2009/06/do-not-ask-a-theist-to-explain-gods-actions/comment-page-1/#comment-3079 The Evil God Hypothesis « Camels With Hammers Mon, 17 May 2010 21:27:36 +0000 http://conversationalatheist.com/?p=1041#comment-3079 [...] Conversational Atheist and I made similar arguments last summer.  Law beat both of us to the idea in 2007 on his blog, [...]<div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('3079','The Evil God Hypothesis « Camels With Hammers'); return false;">Reply</a> | <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('3079','The Evil God Hypothesis « Camels With Hammers','[...] Conversational Atheist and I made similar arguments last summer.  Law beat both of us to the idea in 2007 on his blog, [...]'); return false;">Quote</a></div> [...] Conversational Atheist and I made similar arguments last summer.  Law beat both of us to the idea in 2007 on his blog, [...]
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]]> By: ohboy http://conversationalatheist.com/2009/06/do-not-ask-a-theist-to-explain-gods-actions/comment-page-1/#comment-2962 ohboy Mon, 26 Apr 2010 05:58:29 +0000 http://conversationalatheist.com/?p=1041#comment-2962 i believe in unicorns, where do i send my money <div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('2962','ohboy'); return false;">Reply</a> | <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('2962','ohboy',' i believe in unicorns, where do i send my money '); return false;">Quote</a></div> i believe in unicorns, where do i send my money
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]]> By: ConverseAtheist http://conversationalatheist.com/2009/06/do-not-ask-a-theist-to-explain-gods-actions/comment-page-1/#comment-2369 ConverseAtheist Thu, 11 Feb 2010 19:08:20 +0000 http://conversationalatheist.com/?p=1041#comment-2369 "I have NEVER heard of this silly non-sense because it CLEARLY DOES NOT EXIST. There are MANY facts that prove that God exists!!" I'm glad you don't believe in unicorns, but I'd like to hear a bit more about why you think that they clearly don't exist. How are you skeptical of this mythical creature? Courtney: "When it comes to talking about God's morals or even one beings morals, that is a place where we just cannot go (I do not attempt to go there) Unless scripture directly quotes it!!" When God ordered His followers to kill men, women, children and infants with swords in First Samuel 15; if you were alive back then, would you have questioned God's order? Or would you have devotedly stabbed children to death in obedience to the God-whose-morals-you-never-question? By the way, I hope you stick around to continue this discussion. <div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('2369','ConverseAtheist'); return false;">Reply</a> | <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('2369','ConverseAtheist','"I have NEVER heard of this silly non-sense because it CLEARLY DOES NOT EXIST. There are MANY facts that prove that God exists!!" \n \nI'm glad you don't believe in unicorns, but I'd like to hear a bit more about why you think that they clearly don't exist. How are you skeptical of this mythical creature? \n \nCourtney: "When it comes to talking about God's morals or even one beings morals, that is a place where we just cannot go (I do not attempt to go there) Unless scripture directly quotes it!!" \n \nWhen God ordered His followers to kill men, women, children and infants with swords in First Samuel 15; if you were alive back then, would you have questioned God's order? Or would you have devotedly stabbed children to death in obedience to the God-whose-morals-you-never-question? \n \nBy the way, I hope you stick around to continue this discussion. '); return false;">Quote</a></div> "I have NEVER heard of this silly non-sense because it CLEARLY DOES NOT EXIST. There are MANY facts that prove that God exists!!"

I'm glad you don't believe in unicorns, but I'd like to hear a bit more about why you think that they clearly don't exist. How are you skeptical of this mythical creature?

Courtney: "When it comes to talking about God's morals or even one beings morals, that is a place where we just cannot go (I do not attempt to go there) Unless scripture directly quotes it!!"

When God ordered His followers to kill men, women, children and infants with swords in First Samuel 15; if you were alive back then, would you have questioned God's order? Or would you have devotedly stabbed children to death in obedience to the God-whose-morals-you-never-question?

By the way, I hope you stick around to continue this discussion.

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]]> By: Courtney http://conversationalatheist.com/2009/06/do-not-ask-a-theist-to-explain-gods-actions/comment-page-1/#comment-2366 Courtney Thu, 11 Feb 2010 14:37:58 +0000 http://conversationalatheist.com/?p=1041#comment-2366 You totally missed my point but in the same breath you satisfied my argument!! "Up to this point NOBODY believed that If people believed that praying to unicorns helped cancer victims, and money was spent on a project like this--" I have NEVER heard of this silly non-sense because it CLEARLY DOES NOT EXIST. There are MANY facts that prove that God exists!! Have you ever been in a room and someone says "I farted"? Well, by "faith" you believe that they farted. Then your actions set in...you hold your nose, or possibly remove yourself from the room. At no time did you hear, see, or even smell the fart. Of course I am not comparing God to gas....but I feel that he is treated as if he does not exist because people cannot see, hear, smell, etc. him! Unless God has "regenerated" your heart (chose you to be a child of God / A Christian) then it will be a FOREVER argument on the non-believer's end. When it comes to talking about God's morals or even one beings morals, that is a place where we just cannot go (I do not attempt to go there) Unless scripture directly quotes it!! I am now choosing to not post any further comments on this website. Having someone say that God's actions are not praiseworthy is absent minded . He sent his son to die on the cross for US (action)...He created you (action), He forgives us of our sins (action)...etc. Need I go any further??? I will continue to pray that God regenerates your heart! <div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('2366','Courtney'); return false;">Reply</a> | <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('2366','Courtney','You totally missed my point but in the same breath you satisfied my argument!! "Up to this point NOBODY believed that If people believed that praying to unicorns helped cancer victims, and money was spent on a project like this--" I have NEVER heard of this silly non-sense because it CLEARLY DOES NOT EXIST. There are MANY facts that prove that God exists!! Have you ever been in a room and someone says "I farted"? Well, by "faith" you believe that they farted. Then your actions set in...you hold your nose, or possibly remove yourself from the room. At no time did you hear, see, or even smell the fart. Of course I am not comparing God to gas....but I feel that he is treated as if he does not exist because people cannot see, hear, smell, etc. him! Unless God has "regenerated" your heart (chose you to be a child of God \/ A Christian) then it will be a FOREVER argument on the non-believer's end. When it comes to talking about God's morals or even one beings morals, that is a place where we just cannot go (I do not attempt to go there) Unless scripture directly quotes it!! I am now choosing to not post any further comments on this website. Having someone say that God's actions are not praiseworthy is absent minded . He sent his son to die on the cross for US (action)...He created you (action), He forgives us of our sins (action)...etc. Need I go any further??? I will continue to pray that God regenerates your heart! '); return false;">Quote</a></div> You totally missed my point but in the same breath you satisfied my argument!! "Up to this point NOBODY believed that If people believed that praying to unicorns helped cancer victims, and money was spent on a project like this--" I have NEVER heard of this silly non-sense because it CLEARLY DOES NOT EXIST. There are MANY facts that prove that God exists!! Have you ever been in a room and someone says "I farted"? Well, by "faith" you believe that they farted. Then your actions set in...you hold your nose, or possibly remove yourself from the room. At no time did you hear, see, or even smell the fart. Of course I am not comparing God to gas....but I feel that he is treated as if he does not exist because people cannot see, hear, smell, etc. him! Unless God has "regenerated" your heart (chose you to be a child of God / A Christian) then it will be a FOREVER argument on the non-believer's end. When it comes to talking about God's morals or even one beings morals, that is a place where we just cannot go (I do not attempt to go there) Unless scripture directly quotes it!! I am now choosing to not post any further comments on this website. Having someone say that God's actions are not praiseworthy is absent minded . He sent his son to die on the cross for US (action)...He created you (action), He forgives us of our sins (action)...etc. Need I go any further??? I will continue to pray that God regenerates your heart!
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]]> By: Courtney http://conversationalatheist.com/2009/06/do-not-ask-a-theist-to-explain-gods-actions/comment-page-1/#comment-2367 Courtney Thu, 11 Feb 2010 14:37:58 +0000 http://conversationalatheist.com/?p=1041#comment-2367 You totally missed my point but in the same breath you satisfied my argument!! "Up to this point NOBODY believed that If people believed that praying to unicorns helped cancer victims, and money was spent on a project like this--" I have NEVER heard of this silly non-sense because it CLEARLY DOES NOT EXIST. There are MANY facts that prove that God exists!! Have you ever been in a room and someone says "I farted"? Well, by "faith" you believe that they farted. Then your actions set in...you hold your nose, or possibly remove yourself from the room. At no time did you hear, see, or even smell the fart. Of course I am not comparing God to gas....but I feel that he is treated as if he does not exist because people cannot see, hear, smell, etc. him! Unless God has "regenerated" your heart (chose you to be a child of God / A Christian) then it will be a FOREVER argument on the non-believer's end. When it comes to talking about God's morals or even one beings morals, that is a place where we just cannot go (I do not attempt to go there) Unless scripture directly quotes it!! I am now choosing to not post any further comments on this website. Having someone say that God's actions are not praiseworthy is absent minded . He sent his son to die on the cross for US (action)...He created you (action), He forgives us of our sins (action)...etc. Need I go any further??? I will continue to pray that God regenerates your heart! <div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('2367','Courtney'); return false;">Reply</a> | <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('2367','Courtney','You totally missed my point but in the same breath you satisfied my argument!! "Up to this point NOBODY believed that If people believed that praying to unicorns helped cancer victims, and money was spent on a project like this--" I have NEVER heard of this silly non-sense because it CLEARLY DOES NOT EXIST. There are MANY facts that prove that God exists!! Have you ever been in a room and someone says "I farted"? Well, by "faith" you believe that they farted. Then your actions set in...you hold your nose, or possibly remove yourself from the room. At no time did you hear, see, or even smell the fart. Of course I am not comparing God to gas....but I feel that he is treated as if he does not exist because people cannot see, hear, smell, etc. him! Unless God has "regenerated" your heart (chose you to be a child of God \/ A Christian) then it will be a FOREVER argument on the non-believer's end. When it comes to talking about God's morals or even one beings morals, that is a place where we just cannot go (I do not attempt to go there) Unless scripture directly quotes it!! I am now choosing to not post any further comments on this website. Having someone say that God's actions are not praiseworthy is absent minded . He sent his son to die on the cross for US (action)...He created you (action), He forgives us of our sins (action)...etc. Need I go any further??? I will continue to pray that God regenerates your heart! '); return false;">Quote</a></div> You totally missed my point but in the same breath you satisfied my argument!! "Up to this point NOBODY believed that If people believed that praying to unicorns helped cancer victims, and money was spent on a project like this--" I have NEVER heard of this silly non-sense because it CLEARLY DOES NOT EXIST. There are MANY facts that prove that God exists!! Have you ever been in a room and someone says "I farted"? Well, by "faith" you believe that they farted. Then your actions set in...you hold your nose, or possibly remove yourself from the room. At no time did you hear, see, or even smell the fart. Of course I am not comparing God to gas....but I feel that he is treated as if he does not exist because people cannot see, hear, smell, etc. him! Unless God has "regenerated" your heart (chose you to be a child of God / A Christian) then it will be a FOREVER argument on the non-believer's end. When it comes to talking about God's morals or even one beings morals, that is a place where we just cannot go (I do not attempt to go there) Unless scripture directly quotes it!! I am now choosing to not post any further comments on this website. Having someone say that God's actions are not praiseworthy is absent minded . He sent his son to die on the cross for US (action)...He created you (action), He forgives us of our sins (action)...etc. Need I go any further??? I will continue to pray that God regenerates your heart!
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]]> By: Courtney http://conversationalatheist.com/2009/06/do-not-ask-a-theist-to-explain-gods-actions/comment-page-1/#comment-2326 Courtney Sat, 06 Feb 2010 04:16:24 +0000 http://conversationalatheist.com/?p=1041#comment-2326 Mysterious Motives? God does not perform mysterious motives. He has a reason and purpose for EVERYTHING...we just might not know them all right here today!! <div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('2326','Courtney'); return false;">Reply</a> | <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('2326','Courtney','Mysterious Motives? God does not perform mysterious motives. He has a reason and purpose for EVERYTHING...we just might not know them all right here today!! '); return false;">Quote</a></div> Mysterious Motives? God does not perform mysterious motives. He has a reason and purpose for EVERYTHING...we just might not know them all right here today!!
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]]> By: ConverseAtheist http://conversationalatheist.com/2009/06/do-not-ask-a-theist-to-explain-gods-actions/comment-page-1/#comment-2328 ConverseAtheist Fri, 05 Feb 2010 21:52:40 +0000 http://conversationalatheist.com/?p=1041#comment-2328 Courtney: "I can do ANYTHING I want to do with it. I created it for my purpose!!... Same way God gas created us (for his glory)'''' I DO NOT SEE GOD TO BE AN EVIL CREATURE. Hw is a just God and very merciful!!" So, if you could not possibly mistreat your Lego city -- literally nothing you ever did to it, melt it, rip it apart, whatever -- could be considered evil. Ok, I accept your analysis, explain to me if there can be no moral condemnation for the way you treat your creation, how could there be moral praise for the way you treat your creation? Either your creation is a thing that you can interact with in a morally meaningful way -- or not. If you can interact with your creation in a way that is praiseworthy, it is also possible for you to interact with your creation in a way that is morally condemnable. If it simply is not possible to interact in a way that is morally condemnable to your own creation, fine, you also cannot act in a way that is morally praiseworthy. Let's bring this back to God. You can say that no matter what God does He cannot mistreat something that He created -- fine. Then since it isn't even possible for him to do otherwise, God's actions -- whatever they are -- are not praiseworthy, either. <div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('2328','ConverseAtheist'); return false;">Reply</a> | <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('2328','ConverseAtheist','Courtney: "I can do ANYTHING I want to do with it. I created it for my purpose!!... Same way God gas created us (for his glory)'''' I DO NOT SEE GOD TO BE AN EVIL CREATURE. Hw is a just God and very merciful!!" \n \nSo, if you could not possibly mistreat your Lego city -- literally nothing you ever did to it, melt it, rip it apart, whatever -- could be considered evil. Ok, I accept your analysis, explain to me if there can be no moral condemnation for the way you treat your creation, how could there be moral praise for the way you treat your creation? \n \nEither your creation is a thing that you can interact with in a morally meaningful way -- or not. If you can interact with your creation in a way that is praiseworthy, it is also possible for you to interact with your creation in a way that is morally condemnable. \n \nIf it simply is not possible to interact in a way that is morally condemnable to your own creation, fine, you also cannot act in a way that is morally praiseworthy. \n \nLet's bring this back to God. You can say that no matter what God does He cannot mistreat something that He created -- fine. Then since it isn't even possible for him to do otherwise, God's actions -- whatever they are -- are not praiseworthy, either. '); return false;">Quote</a></div> Courtney: "I can do ANYTHING I want to do with it. I created it for my purpose!!... Same way God gas created us (for his glory)'''' I DO NOT SEE GOD TO BE AN EVIL CREATURE. Hw is a just God and very merciful!!"

So, if you could not possibly mistreat your Lego city -- literally nothing you ever did to it, melt it, rip it apart, whatever -- could be considered evil. Ok, I accept your analysis, explain to me if there can be no moral condemnation for the way you treat your creation, how could there be moral praise for the way you treat your creation?

Either your creation is a thing that you can interact with in a morally meaningful way -- or not. If you can interact with your creation in a way that is praiseworthy, it is also possible for you to interact with your creation in a way that is morally condemnable.

If it simply is not possible to interact in a way that is morally condemnable to your own creation, fine, you also cannot act in a way that is morally praiseworthy.

Let's bring this back to God. You can say that no matter what God does He cannot mistreat something that He created -- fine. Then since it isn't even possible for him to do otherwise, God's actions -- whatever they are -- are not praiseworthy, either.

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]]> By: ConverseAtheist http://conversationalatheist.com/2009/06/do-not-ask-a-theist-to-explain-gods-actions/comment-page-1/#comment-2327 ConverseAtheist Fri, 05 Feb 2010 21:42:42 +0000 http://conversationalatheist.com/?p=1041#comment-2327 Courtney: "It is OBVIOUS that there is a God because if there were not one then why would people be trying to prove that he does not exist?" Good question. Do I argue with God about anything? No. Do I argue with people who believe in God? Yes. What is it that exists? People who believe in God -- that should explain everything. If no one believed in God, then I would have no argument with anyone. If people believed that praying to unicorns helped cancer victims, and money was spent on a project like this -- I would have an issue with the people who believed in unicorns. The fact that unicorns do not exist is completely irrelevant. The fact that PEOPLE exist who believe in unicorns -- or God -- is entirely relevant. <div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('2327','ConverseAtheist'); return false;">Reply</a> | <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('2327','ConverseAtheist','Courtney: "It is OBVIOUS that there is a God because if there were not one then why would people be trying to prove that he does not exist?" \n \nGood question. Do I argue with God about anything? No. Do I argue with people who believe in God? Yes. What is it that exists? People who believe in God -- that should explain everything. \n \nIf no one believed in God, then I would have no argument with anyone. If people believed that praying to unicorns helped cancer victims, and money was spent on a project like this -- I would have an issue with the people who believed in unicorns. The fact that unicorns do not exist is completely irrelevant. The fact that PEOPLE exist who believe in unicorns -- or God -- is entirely relevant. '); return false;">Quote</a></div> Courtney: "It is OBVIOUS that there is a God because if there were not one then why would people be trying to prove that he does not exist?"

Good question. Do I argue with God about anything? No. Do I argue with people who believe in God? Yes. What is it that exists? People who believe in God -- that should explain everything.

If no one believed in God, then I would have no argument with anyone. If people believed that praying to unicorns helped cancer victims, and money was spent on a project like this -- I would have an issue with the people who believed in unicorns. The fact that unicorns do not exist is completely irrelevant. The fact that PEOPLE exist who believe in unicorns -- or God -- is entirely relevant.

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]]> By: Courtney http://conversationalatheist.com/2009/06/do-not-ask-a-theist-to-explain-gods-actions/comment-page-1/#comment-2322 Courtney Fri, 05 Feb 2010 19:43:18 +0000 http://conversationalatheist.com/?p=1041#comment-2322 Wow! I apologize for taking so long to get Back with you!! BUSY, BUSY, BUSY!! YES! I do personally (and so should every Christian believe in the bible as a whole!! Revelation 22:18 warns everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds anything to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book. 19 And if anyone takes words away from this book of prophecy, God will take away from him his share in the tree of life and in the holy city, which are described in this book. Therefore, If I did not believe in something such as 1 Samual 15 then my own beliefs would not be totally 100% bound to scripture (God's word)! Truly, what goes on in my head is that if I build a lego city then because it is mine...I can do ANYTHING I want to do with it. I created it for my purpose!! Same way God gas created us (for his glory)'''' I DO NOT SEE GOD TO BE AN EVIL CREATURE. Hw is a just God and very merciful!! I hoe this helps and to hear from you soon! Courtney <div class="comment-remix-meta"><a href="#" class="replyto" onclick="replyto('2322','Courtney'); return false;">Reply</a> | <a href="#" class="quote" onclick="quote('2322','Courtney','Wow! I apologize for taking so long to get Back with you!! BUSY, BUSY, BUSY!! YES! I do personally (and so should every Christian believe in the bible as a whole!! Revelation 22:18 warns everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds anything to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book. 19 And if anyone takes words away from this book of prophecy, God will take away from him his share in the tree of life and in the holy city, which are described in this book. Therefore, If I did not believe in something such as 1 Samual 15 then my own beliefs would not be totally 100% bound to scripture (God's word)! Truly, what goes on in my head is that if I build a lego city then because it is mine...I can do ANYTHING I want to do with it. I created it for my purpose!! Same way God gas created us (for his glory)'''' I DO NOT SEE GOD TO BE AN EVIL CREATURE. Hw is a just God and very merciful!! I hoe this helps and to hear from you soon! Courtney \n '); return false;">Quote</a></div> Wow! I apologize for taking so long to get Back with you!! BUSY, BUSY, BUSY!! YES! I do personally (and so should every Christian believe in the bible as a whole!! Revelation 22:18 warns everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds anything to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book. 19 And if anyone takes words away from this book of prophecy, God will take away from him his share in the tree of life and in the holy city, which are described in this book. Therefore, If I did not believe in something such as 1 Samual 15 then my own beliefs would not be totally 100% bound to scripture (God's word)! Truly, what goes on in my head is that if I build a lego city then because it is mine...I can do ANYTHING I want to do with it. I created it for my purpose!! Same way God gas created us (for his glory)'''' I DO NOT SEE GOD TO BE AN EVIL CREATURE. Hw is a just God and very merciful!! I hoe this helps and to hear from you soon! Courtney

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